Tuesday, January 09, 2007

Tottenham Hotspur HOOLIGANISM The Facts



Last year I found myself travelling to see Spurs at home to Wigan from Colchester in Essex. Colchester United were that same day playing a Cup tie with a later kick off against Chelsea.
At 9am Colchester North Station platform 4 began to fill with the usual grizzly looking 'Bar Side' suspects. My interest in this mob only extended as far as not getting stuck on the same train as them. But my ears pricked when I heard two lads mentioning Tottenham.

"Spurs have Wigan but they won't be at it there."
"No, that's right - coached in and out."
"Tottenham are very active at the moment."
"Really? I hadn't heard that." (laughing)
"Very much so."
"Do they have many then?"
"My guy tells me we'll see them today."
"At the Bridge?"
"No, Liverpool Street. They would catch us on the way out and any Chelsea that had come to see us off."

So what is the deal with Tottenham these days? Has there been a rebirth of hooligan culture in N17? I want opinion, but first here are some FACTS from the Home Office relating to the period ending October 2006 (which are the most up to date available).

Football Related Arrests:
169
Highest in Premiership. The figure is split as Home Games 44 and Away Games 122.

Further Breakdown:

Violent Disorder 3
Public Disorder 16
Missile Throwing 0
Racist Chanting 3
Pitch Incursion 1
Alcohol Offences 34
Ticket Touting 2
Offences Against Property 0
Possession Of An Offensive Weapon 0
Breach Of Banning Order 1
Breach Of The Peace 108
Miscellaneous 1

So it would appear that there is for want of a better phrase to be plenty of activity both home and away from Spurs fans. But these are last season's figures. Perhaps you think they will be lower than this. Perhaps considerably higher. Tell us.

The purpose of this is to hear your views, but mindless threats towards other supporters etc are generally dull so let's keep it informed, eh folks?






30 comments:

dannyboy said...

HH

my view is, I thought this was 'a football blog on all matters Tottenham?'
what is this about? sounds like you're proud of a football hooligan element?
knowing that impressionable youngsters read this, this is a tasteless blog in my view - sorry.

sigh....

Anonymous said...

we are gangasta init!!!
but shit on the football pitch :) what a joke.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Jonnie said...

Harry I have full respect for your blog and pride in Tottenham. Dannyboy - if the facts stand then this is a Tottenham matter. I believe we are one of the most vocal set of supporters in the country and should be proud of how we love our Club through good times and bad. If any element is present that could effect our history and future then it should be discussed. Only by highlighting it will it be dealt with - whatever the cause. I urge anyone who knows anything about this matter to discuss it here and directly with the club.

Harry Hotspur said...

Dannyboy, not proud at all, this is all part and parcel of attending games and has been since gawd knows when.

As I put at the end of the post, I'm not interested in the 'your gonna die' end of the market and if you look mate, I where I thought it fair to do so, I deleted the cavemen that came on here.

Tasteless might have been to comprise a top ten or similar. I found it very east to resist running such a piece.

What I would like are shared experiences. Condemnations are as welcome as tales of Stone Island coloured jigs & reels.

If Tottenham fans get repeatedly arrested. That is a matter Tottenham. Maybe one some want to distance themselves from, but a reality nevertheless.....

biz said...

premature ejaculation?

this article doesn't constitute a worthwhile story. The facts? not many except for a number of arrests... Why not hold off on writing it until you'd done a bit of research or hung around some pubs (t.c.p) before games?

To ask if we have a hooligan element is not the right question - you should've asked: to what extent do we have one?

108 'breach of peace' arrests do not convince me that each of those detained were hooligans either. A breach of peace could be a narked steward complaining to a policeman who got out of bed on the wrong side of bed about you jeering their fans - hardly hooligan behaviour.

If only you'd not got excited by it harry and done some homework.

Harry Hotspur said...

Biz.

Hanging around pubs? Mmmn. Your kind of journalistic research gets people into trouble.

I think the Home Office stats are substantial enough.

Nor is it inaccurate to call those that comprised them football hooligans. Does your local library or fish mongers or table taennis club generate such figures?

You can play them down/ dismiss them, but they are real. You seem unappreciative of the fact that I provided the breakdown. The breakdown might have just as easily generated the headline ' Spurs Fans Can't Take Their Drink'.

And finally, I DID ask to what extent their was a problem.

Read what I wrote!

dannyboy said...

HH

anon 9.53 rests my case.

i totally agree with your reply and am as passionate as my beloved spurs as the next fan. just think the way the post is written could be read as a glorification of hooliganism by some of the younger readers (he knows who I mean!) and the 'cavemen' as you put it.

your blogs are normally of an interesting and well written manner - I guess we choose to disagree on this one. that's what's called free speech, long may it continue !! be careful you're not accused of inciting anything !!

jonnie - we certainly are one of the most vocal sets of supporters, you only have to be at the Lane or listen on sky sports to accept that, unless you're deaf !!

COYS

Anonymous said...

There is aproud element at Tottenham who revell in the violence and rarely attend matches. The same is also true of other clubs. The 'firms' are well known to each other and arrange 'meetings' generally away from the ground and 'normal supporters'

Whilst I know a number of the Spurs firm, I have little to do with them and certainly do not have any regard for them as hooligans. However, as previously stated they do normally avoid inclusion of innocent passers by unless they are particularly mouthy.

I am old enough to remember the 70's & 80's when it was unsafe to stray from a group, take your children or girlfriend. So the current situation whilst not ideal is it is a massive improvement on the past and to some extent in decline as a result of improved Police intelligence.

Football is tribalistic, there are those who vent their spleen on by singing and verbal abuse in the stadium and those who prefer the crunch of bone on bone. I have seen more violence from locals on locals in the Tottenham area on match day than fan on fan.

If these people want to fight each other why not let them so long as they do keep it to themselves.

Anonymous said...

these pr*cks are gonna get us kicked out of europe again. whats the point in calling yourself a tottenham fan in which case? you might aswell be pissing all over the cockrell.

Anonymous said...

Its true that most offences are breach of the peace, which is very low on the crime scale. Check out Chelsea's stats on Violent disorder and missile throwing, or west ham's on racist chanting.

Special mention should go to Watford fans, of whom two were arrested last year. Stilll two too many, I hear you say, but impressive none the leass.

Anonymous said...

Thoroughly distasteful subject for a blog. Really surprised. Get back on to football and save this crap for the BNP.

Anonymous said...

arsescum in the semis - feck, 6-3, fecking hell, im nervous already

kenneth williams said...

10:54

'Thoroughly distasteful on a blog?'

Get lost you pilchard.

Anonymous said...

"Only by highlighting it will it be dealt with - whatever the cause. I urge anyone who knows anything about this matter to discuss it here and directly with the club."

a sensible comment. The bnp? Are they they ones selling lager and causing all the stats then? lol. i don't see m/any hoolies around the ground but as the other fella on was saying i think they meet up elsewhere. i did get beaten up at old trafford once harry, does that make me a home office statistic too harry?

Anonymous said...

The scum in the semis.....nothing to be scared. Tonight was no indication of what to expect as both teams fielded their reserves. (almost)

I was at scumbury for the 3-0 and they got two very dodgy pens. However, they did play better than us.

We will rise to the occasion at home, although I'm not sure how we will fare in the away leg!!

COYS

DoubleVision said...

ummm @ kenneth williams 10:54 "Get lost you pilchard". Yr as bad as the thugs lol... i am all in favour of people that want to fight they go do it with consenting adults... i prefer cockerels. I so hope that the scum put out their reserves ie sAme team that beat Liverpool, cos we will whoop them! COYS

Anonymous said...

all spurs stick togeverwe are proud with the yiddo follwing we can match any foirm i did it years ago and do itnoe thfc for ever

Anonymous said...

I've got to say that I'm always on the look out for "Aggro Merchants" in the area surrounding WHL, due to the fact that I have a season ticket with my girlfriend and want to avoid that element at all costs. The fact of the matter is, that the decline of football hooliganism since the '80s is minimal. The difference now is, that it is organised away from the ground. There are numerous small clusters of fellas dotted around, communicating on mobiles and seemingly arranging a tear-up away from the ground itself. That's why the police report figures have dropped, because if the incidents don't occur within recognised areas, they aren't counted as football violence. It still goes on but unless you're there to see it, you don't hear about it.

sydney wale said...

I 'm finding this all a bit of a worry with the feyenorrd game coming up. Have you seen the mob from rotterdam? It will take a good show from spurs to deter these fellas. Mix in a very large slice of history and the fuse shortens.

NB. we were the first uk team banned from europe for the riot in rotterdam.
My suggestion;
Simmer Down!

As usual harry asks the questions...

Anonymous said...

Well, Harry,let's talk about strategics and hope Jol will listen:
1. concentrate on 4th place Prem ( every game until the last minute) so we can be on The CL next year.
2. Forget the Carling Cup. we should avoid defeat at home and rest best players away against Arsenal. Don't give up without a fight but it is quite hopeless with the scum right now.
3. Two non Prem teams home ahead of us in the FA Cup. We need to smash them. No discussion. Just do it !
4. UEFA CUP: still our biggest aim. It's important because it's international. it gives the club renown. Feyenoord is hard but we can beat them home and then, probably, we'll have an empty stadium down there.
5. Against Fulham away we need to win and score without complex. Clear the heads, lads and go for it. it's high time !
COYS !
truelovespurs

Anonymous said...

Apparently Michael Jackson has hired rafa benitez as his manager coz he heard that he likes to get beaten at home by 11 kids.

Yid15.

Anonymous said...

I got that text too!

James said...

122 arrests over a 40 game season doesn't really add up to much does it. Yes you don't get those kind of figures at your local library, but you also do not get 36,000 people attending your local library week in week out!

Yes I have seen my fair share of violence in the past, some of it not very pretty, but like mentioned in the posts, the majority of it is well away from and of the grounds, and the majority of the fans who watch their team week in week out! I for one learnt the hard way not to wear colours at away games, as you can never be sure of who is lurking about once you move away from the ground, but thats just common sense.

I actually watched the Leverkausen game in a pub in Cologne surrounded by many of the Spurs 'Firm' the majority of whom were well behaved, and certainly not running through the streets smashing up property and beating up the innocent!

Yes you are always going to get the minority that attend games to cause trouble, but they mainly do that away from the fans who just go to watch the game!

Anonymous said...

So, Mourinho is leaving Chelsea and Benitez is leaving Liverpool. Great for us, mates. Next year we'll only have to deal with MU and Arse !

db said...

time for a new post?
how about one to suggest what the next post should be ?!

Anonymous said...

How about an article on Dan Levy's pay rise?

Anonymous said...

how about whos the best player you have personally ever seen in a spurs shirt and why? time for a reminisce!

sydney wale said...

Hoddle or Gazza?

Anonymous said...

Harry mate just looked at your facts on hooliganism from the home office and that don't add up mate. 44 at ome and 122 away? thats 166 incidents mate i know thus ain't nuffin big just thought i'd mention it, result against bolton get in!